Oscar Sanchez and Marbis Manzanet. Photo: Oscar Sanchez. Photo: Angel Gabriel Carrera. Eyes that saw you GO, should see you COME BACK
Oscar Sánchez is one of those artists who, for better or for worse, blows the minds of anyone who sees him performing his music, whether it's on the stage of a bar or in a download at three in the morning in any park. Contrasting with his irreverent texts and his energetic stage projection, Oscar is a highly sensitive and humble being, with a strong discipline towards his art and a tremendous restlessness that drives him to constant experimentation, always looking for new instruments —or new forms of playing the old ones—, and having an unusual taste in music that covers a huge range of styles.
Between 2016 and 2017 he recorded his second independent album as a duo with the singer Marbis Manzanet, entitled Eyes that saw you GO, NEVER will see you COME BACK, an intimate and reflective album, where the trova is wrapped up with stylistic elements of electronic music. This is an artisanal, imperfect and beautiful phonogram, capable of penetrating to the very marrow of those who listen to it, and which —I dare to conjecture— has not received the attention it deserves. So one afternoon the three of us met in a Havana garden to talk about this album that, without a doubt, should come back.
Oscar is normally associated with a type of visceral, untimely, funny, irreverent, colloquial, very temperamental song... However, in Eyes… we find more poetic, intimate, reflective, sensitive compositions, why this radical change? When did you start composing in this way?
Oscar Sanchez: It is true that I am generally associated with irreverence, madness, joy... all very stunning. Pigeonholing someone is very easy. I notice that there is today a very big tendency to pigeonhole musicians as well as painters, athletes... It has become almost a necessity, and not only for the public: you need your hashtags, forever. you need your hashtags to feel safe. But some can't hack.
I started composing when I was 17 years old. In that first stage of creation, my songs followed that more romantic, lyrical or troubadour path, if you will. Of course, I always winked at irreverence, at Cuban picaresque, and I also tried to dialogue with my reality and question it.
I usually express what happens to me through songs and, like many, I have experienced several loves and heartbreaks. That he wrote that album, as you say, so intimate, introspective or poetic, is not strange to me. And really, it's not even a change. It is, at best, a revisiting of an earlier stage.
On the other hand, I didn't make that up to please anyone, or to sell an album, or to reach a new audience. I made no concessions. These songs came from a specific moment, from an emotional situation that I was going through. They were born from genuine feelings, which I channeled. Are those the songs that are coming to me? Well, welcome!
The album is crossed by pain, ghosts, sadness, disappointments… Where did these feelings and anguish come from?
YOU: As I was telling you, I was going through a complex emotional situation. A platonic love. I was loving a person without knowing why I was doing it. I didn't even know her. I just saw her and it was... Cupid! Cupid appeared at that moment and made me:chaxtake yours!
Marbis Manzanet: You even settled for it to be that way.
YOU: Exact. I convinced myself that this was crazy on me and decided not to fight. But, well, it generated that group of songs that ended up making up the album. It is an album of love and heartbreak as well. About what happens when you love and are not loved, or when the other person doesn't even find out and you don't dare to tell them clearly for fear of rejection. That's what the album is about. The feelings and anxieties that you say you see come precisely from those conflicts and contradictions. Even To kill all the living, which apparently has nothing romantic, in itself is a form of love, because I want you so intensely that what I want is dismember you, dismember you, catch you, kill you and kill you. But in a loving sense. Sexual, if you want… If you want, no, sexual.
On the album I see influences from Juana Molina, Lisandro Aristimuño, and even songs that remind me of Nicola Cruz or industrial music. This may well be armed relations in my head, although I hear them very clearly. What influences permeated when composing these songs?
YOU: At that time I was listening to a lot of alt-J and Fink, especially the Sort of Revolution. I had already heard Lisandro Aristimuño and Juana Molina, as well as Radiohead, Björk, Trent Reznor, and other bands and artists with similar sounds, which I can't remember now. He hadn't heard Nicola Cruz yet. So I had all that background which, of course, served me well as an influence. I remember that I bombarded Marbis with all that. I told him: “Look, this is the music I'm listening to, I like it a lot and I want to try to do something like that, with that spirit”. And so we were projecting, little by little, the sound of the album.
MM: Certainly the songs that came out for Oscar were very musical and emotional. So it was not difficult to glimpse the feeling in which they were wrapped. And, since I am a highly melancholic person, I joined that feeling and gave it a little of mine, I think I contributed something to it.
YOU: I also remember when I did Your voice does not stop escapingFor example, I had very close contact with Edwin Casanova, one of the members of Nacional Electrónica. I told him about the idea that I had been developing and he supported me: he told me that he believed I was on an interesting path and shared programs and music. When most people think of electronic music, they think of um um um, acid up top, um um um. And there are really other ways of approaching electronic music, more elaborate, using the environment to put you in a specific mood, and that's what I was looking for. That's why I say it's a moody, emotional album. I'm going to condition you, through sound, a feeling, a way of thinking. I will even try not only to make your psyche, but also your physical body feel invaded or touched by that amalgamation of sensations.
MM: Many times when you talk about electronic music, people think that the instruments are simply an ornament. In this case it was the other way around; that is, these songs can perfectly be made acoustic. The electronic sounds served to create the atmosphere that puts you in a certain state of mind or sentiment. The instruments weren't adorning an electronic theme. They are the resources provided by electronic music, they are part of the ghost of a song.
The absence of the producer is noticeable on the album: some arrangements still seem unpolished and technically there are recording, mixing and equalization errors. Why did you take the risk of self-producing, especially when it came to your first steps in electronic music?
YOU: But why do you say that there is no producer?
Because you notice details in some songs that you say, well, something is missing or this is superfluous. For me one of the most important things in the work of the producer is the external vision that he can contribute. And in this case you were beginning to experiment with electronic music…
MM: I think it was not a decision as such, right?
YOU: Yes…
MM: We were really flirting with these new tools and sounds, and we never thought “we're not going to have a producer”. Things were happening. We did it under arrest, right? Let's see what happens, without intending much more than doing it for the pure pleasure of working together and exploring a new universe. Now, this is not to say that we didn't take it seriously.
YOU: On the other hand, I wasn't willing to wait four, five, six months for a third person who could fit me into their schedule or be motivated by the project. I have a brain and I have two hands, so why couldn't I do it? Of course, I don't have all the knowledge or vision of a third person, and I agree that they would contribute something to me, but I wasn't willing to stop my creation process. Because it was a living process… I wrote the songs and we recorded them.
It wasn't that we rejected the producer's idea either. I was quite critical all the time with what we were doing. In general, I work with a very self-critical outlook. I like to pass the blade very low so that later there is no chance. It is obvious that we all make mistakes and learn by making mistakes, but I try not to. It is an exercise that I impose on myself: to be my own judge to mercilessly rip my head off every time I have to do it. I don't like to pass my hands or lick my wounds. You did it wrong? You did it wrong, you have to do it right.
Oscar Sanchez. Photo: Angel Gabriel Carrera
The title of the album seems too long, funny and doesn't respond to the nature or the colors of the album...
YOU: It was actually almost one-sided. One day I arrived at Marbis's house, I proposed that title to her, she liked it, there it was. The gist of the title is Go Never Come Back; everything in between is part of the Cuban picaresque, it allows you to read one meaning, but it is another. It's go away and never come back because I'm dying, you have me crazy, I need to run from here, away from you, at full speed. Maybe that title is long, but what is it long for?
Well, now thinking, if we compare it with the When The Pawn…,[1] by Fiona Apple, it's pretty short. But I say long as to make it work better for…
YOU: To the market? But I don't work for the market, I work from my platform. I don't want to be the Backstreet Boys, I don't want to follow that way of working and seeing music. Because that's not music anymore, that's croquettes, and I don't make croquettes, I make music. From my heart and from my soul. I'd rather do anything for a living than deal in music or make it the center of my economy. In fact, I confess that I worry a lot when I'm just generating money with music. Especially when I realize that I have given up something because of it. Because I don't want to give in, but do what I want with the music. I am happy when I play. I have it very clear from the first song I made. When I picked up a guitar it wasn't to make a girl fall in love or to earn 20 pesos. It was because he needed to touch her and scream. let off steam I do not forget that. It's center.
To kill all the living, sixth theme, it doesn't fit with the other tracks on the album. It comes to break the atmosphere that had been developing. I think this break in the narrative is not overcome in the remaining songs that even come to seem like extras, although they are related to the spirit of the first tracks. Why its inclusion?
YOU: When I arrive To kill all the living I had already processed a little the pain of not being accepted by the person I was loving, and I could be funny and make fun of myself and the situation a little. There is also a very important element: that song was made by me, just like white bougainvillea or Seedless… What I mean by this is that in the end it is the same person who is experiencing an emotional process, in which various states of mind that are reflected in each of these themes follow one another. On the other hand, although we were making a record, we were not creating a product to be a unit. Although, obviously, we came to that because, from my point of view, the album is a solid unit and all the songs are related, although something may sound a bit jarring. as it happens with To kill all the living, which perhaps has more to do with another stage, with another character of the songs, but for me it makes all the sense in the world that it is there.
MM: It's the same person feeling different things...
YOU: Indeed, it is that...
I understand that the song was born from that loving process. But as for the curation of the songs, of the coupling of the album, maybe if it was towards the end or if there was something later that would give more coherence to being in that position...
YOU: Well, at the sound level there is a coherence. Notice that later, Caught, I use the marímbula and in I died-lived the kalimba, which also has a dark tone —like Atrapped, which is a beautiful song, but very dark. I think so, that it has a cohesion.
Another aspect of your work that stands out is that stubbornness in "do it yourself". An example of this are your handmade discs, from everyday raw materials —cardboard, paper, nail polish. Tell me about the design. Why haven't they made a physical edition yet? Now that it is officially presented, do you plan to do it? What ideas are they handling?
YOU: Initially we thought to print the cover on a piece of rectangular cloth using screen printing, embroider some text on it, and make a small pocket where we could put a USB memory with the album and all the audiovisual materials that had been generated as a result of the album. That was the initial idea, which I have not rejected, but that we have not been able to materialize. Because we know that a screen print with so many colors is expensive and hard.
MM: And black and white will not be cheaper?
YOU: Poechito, look how that has colors...! I've also thought about printing it on paper or cardboard. In poster format of 50 x 70 centimeters. I really like the idea of the USB memory to make it more functional, you can take out the materials that we put, reuse the memory, and, of course, it would be decorated with nail polish, it will not be just any memory. This also expands the visual identity of the album.
Those are the ideas I've had about the physique. We haven't been able to execute any yet, but they're close, not that they're impossible. Making physical records today is no longer the goal. But there are always collectors, inveterate music lovers, and for them you have to build them and make a deluxe edition.
In December 2019 they presented the phonogram at Fábrica de Arte Cubano, in the context of the Eyeife Festival with a band that included a DJ, bass, piano, and a vocalist. How was the assembly and arrangement process for this concert?
YOU: Putting on that show was really difficult, because we couldn't find a DJ who was a musician, who understood that it's not just about playing the track and letting it run, but also working on top of it, being aware of the entrances, the exits... I met DJ Milano, who is also a saxophonist and clarinetist, and I saw the possibility of putting on that presentation with him as a DJ. We constantly work with various musicians and putting the band together was not a big problem. Then the assembly was quick. Still, we worked hard on the arrangements and rehearsed as many times as we could.
Were you happy with the result of the concert?
YOU: I was not happy. I am not at all happy with the result of the concert.
MM: Neither do I.
I can't say I'm surprised, as a spectator I wasn't very satisfied either, although I liked most of the arrangements.
YOU: Look, when you have a concert at a festival, and on the night you're going to play there are four bands with complex formats on the same scene, there's a big chance that things won't go well. It was a group of factors that ruined the effort of weeks: finalizing the organizational details that corresponded to the festival team, the poor work of the production and the sound technician at Fábrica are, in my opinion, the main reasons why That night was fateful. We rehearsed and played the best we could, but the technique didn't help us. On stage we didn't hear anything well and that led us down an erratic path when it came to performing the concert. I left very upset that night...
Personally, I think that FAC, both because of the characteristics of its regular audience and because of the conception of the space itself, is a place to have fun with music, not to listen to it, and this is an album that must be listened to very carefully. On the other hand, the audio was terrible and Nave 4, due to its large dimensions, was not the right place for these songs either. Why choose a stage like this for the presentation of the album?
YOU: We did not choose it, that choice was made by the organizers of the Eyeife. You show your proposal to the festival, they review it and then include you on the poster or not. Then they put you in the place and at the time they think is the most appropriate, and you have to trust that because you have no participation, at an organizational level, in choosing the best place. Also, if you are showing a proposal with certain characteristics, that organizing committee is supposed to analyze and say: “We cannot put this music in this place that is for dancing and that is so big. It will work better in this smaller, more intimate room.”
In fact, the concert at FAC lasted 48 minutes and we had 50 for the presentation, a detail that we did not know until the moment we got to play; otherwise we would have organized the show differently. After the last song we managed to play, we had included three more songs, which had more to do with the Nave 4 space. In the end we couldn't play them. It was a more danceable repertoire, more energetic and fun, more in keeping with the place.
This album suits me more with a place like the Theater of the National Museum of Fine Arts, which is one of the best places for small-format concerts in Havana.
YOU: I'm still recovering from the experience, which wasn't exactly kind. I'm used to playing solo, and when I'm with a band things usually go well. Lately, and fortunately, the result of my live shows has been positive. And I'm still recovering from having had a show that wasn't quite it. There were good things, of course, but not to the level I'm used to.
MM: If it was of any use, it was to realize what we don't want... Now we know how it works, we have a practical vision. Until you try it, you don't know for sure what it's like. I feel that despite not being satisfied with this presentation, it has served us well because, even with all these difficulties, I could feel the attention and desire of those who went to see the concert, something that says a lot. People were very keen to see this work live after hearing it.
YOU: Yes of course. One always gets something positive: what do I want, and what do I not want. You are discarding That's life. And it's great that it happened to us. In addition, after this inclusion in the Eyeife I think we should now break the barrier of prejudice and knock on the door of a record company in Cuba that is willing to assume, not so much the production of video clips and physical copies, but the financing for a tour national, to produce a series of concerts where we can show that work properly, with all the necessary technical conditions. Because we have been able to confirm that people like it and constantly congratulate us for this work.
I imagined that the concert at FAC and the presentation of the album would be closing this stage and I've realized that it doesn't close anything. We want to do other things with that music, because it deserves it. The work is good and worth it. Let's see if things flow and it can happen.
What would you like to see happen with this album?
MM: I'm pretty happy with what's happened so far. Knowing that there are a lot of people who have listened to it, who approach you and tell you how much they like the album or that such a song has helped them at some point… That tells me that at least some objective has been achieved. I'm pretty pleased with that so far. I imagine that everything good that can appear out there is already like a bonuses.
YOU: If the truth. That people listen to the album and that they like it is already a goal accomplished. At least to some extent. And I think it has to do with the fact that it is an album that accompanies the listener. That's how I proposed it while we were designing the sound. Beyond the fact that it was a process largely mediated by improvisation and spontaneity, I needed an album that would accompany me sonically, that would be my company in solitude.
I would love for a lot of things to happen. I sincerely believe that not even half of what could happen has happened. Many things can be done, the material is interesting, but I haven't had the courage to contact any record company. This is something I am quite skeptical about. Very skeptical. And, as I was saying just now, I already feel that it is time to break down that self-imposed barrier to see if things take a turn and go somewhere else. Because with the efforts we have made…
MM: We have come this far.
YOU: We have come this far.
